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Sunday, 22 October 2006

Hey, I LIKE Mark Sanford...

A couple of replies to the comment by Chris on the last post. Chris, when you say this...

The problem with editorial endorsements is that it alerts readers to thought processes and reasoning of those making them...

...you point to the precise reason that my colleagues and I on the board write columns -- to elaborate on the reasons we endorse, to give readers additional insight into our thinking so that they have more information upon which to base a judgment of our decision, whatever they choose to make of it. The point of my doing the blog is to go even a little deeper into all that, to give you the chance (if you're at all interested) to know even more about how the editorial page editor ticks, so that you might have even more insight into the editorials. It's so you don't have to guess.

The whole point of an endorsement editorial, as I've said a thousand times, is not the WHO, but the WHY -- the "thought processes and reasoning" behind the decision. It's really hard to get that message across, because it's counterintuitive for a lot of folks. It's not personal, as a Corleone would say. The fact is that -- in this case -- one of these two men is going to be governor. The purpose of an endorsement is to say, knowing what we know (and in part, what we know is based on dealing with these men repeatedly over the course of years), which way we would go if we just have to vote for one of them.

Our reasons, and the reasons behind our reasons, are all we have to offer you. That's what it's about. It's not about whose side we're on, or who we "like." If we went on the basis of who we like, I'd probably have gone with Sanford. I know him, and I personally like him. I really have to force myself to look at what he's doing (and not doing) as governor and shove aside the fact that I like the guy.

I can't say the same for Tommy Moore, which is not to run him down. I just don't know him as well. I've known him at a distance for almost two decades -- much longer than Sanford. But I knew him as an editor dealing with the information that reporters (usually Cindi Scoppe, back in her reporting days) brought to me about him. Mark Sanford I've dealt with directly, ever since he was in Congress, because his political career began about the same time I joined the editorial board.

I've also dealt with him more because he's a wonk like us. He's more into talking about issues than he is about doing anything. I've had the impression that he'd rather pick up the phone to chat with me for 45 minutes about some political theory than sit down and wheedle lawmakers to turn ideas into laws. (At least, he was inclined to do that until a few months ago. I don't think I've heard from him at all since my column about his veto of the budget.)

Sen. Moore has never spent much time talking to editorial types -- at least, not to me. He was over in the State House, getting stuff done. Since he wasn't trying to accomplish abstract goals, he had nothing to chat about with perpetual talkers. So I don't know him that well. I don't think he's figured us out, either. To him, I'm that guy who wrote that he didn't have the "fire in the belly," and he knows he didn't like that.

So why did we not endorse Mark Sanford? Read the endorsement. Then read my column. Then read other columns. Then read everything you can get your hands on, and talk to everyone you know who might know more about these guys and the issues than you do. Then go out and vote any way you think is best.

If you do that, having made our endorsement even a small part of your own process -- even if it's only to tick you off and make you want to do the opposite, and to work harder to find reasons why we're wrong -- then I will have done my job.

Oops. There I go. Revealing thought processes and reasoning again. Sorry. (Not.)

(One other thing, though, Chris -- your comment sort of loses me when you jump from editorial to news coverage, as though there were a connection. If you're suggesting that what we do has anything to do with what the news department does, you are confused. Reporters, and their editors, would likely laugh their heads off at the idea that they agree with our conclusions. That is, they would if so many people, including sometimes candidates, didn't make the same assumption you do, which is a major professional pain for them. I think most news people would just as soon the editorial page go away, as it causes them little but grief. Good thing there's a high wall between our separate divisions to protect us -- there are a lot more of them than there are of us.)

Posted by Brad Warthen at 03:35 PM in Blogosphere, Columns, Elections, Endorsement interviews, Feedback, Leadership, Media, South Carolina, The State
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Comments

A lot of politicians are likable. That is how they attract shallow voters.

The problem ones are those who are cannot control the cancerous growth of government, who cannot say no to buying a vote or paying off a financial backer, or to lining their own pockets.

Tommy Moore has a record of failing to control spending and waste.

Posted by: Lee | Oct 22, 2006 4:45:53 PM

Brad, what comes through is that you are like a single issue voter. Some of the most ardent pro-lifers are single issue. You are single issue on preserving a public education pseudo monopoly. Since you are seemingly principled on the war, taxes, the economy and other areas, I am sort of surprised at this single focus issue, but then again, you have been on this bent, along with Cindy, for some time now.

Posted by: Dave | Oct 22, 2006 7:06:22 PM

Actually, Dave, I'm not. We've endorsed people this year who supported PPIC -- the first one that comes to mind is Kenny Bingham. Kenny slides because he is dedicated to one of our favorite causes, comprehensive tax reform.

Sanford would get by if he had managed to follow through on any part of restructuring, which is an even bigger deal to us than tax reform (a lot bigger, in fact -- as big as it gets). But instead, structural reform was set BACK.

OK, a guy can try and still fail. But he didn't try hard enough, and he kept ticking off lawmakers -- lawmakers who would have loved to work with a governor of their own party, something they had looked forward to all through the Hodges years. But he kept sticking it to them, and playing to the voters AGAINST them, to the point that by the end of this session, they weren't inclined to do anything he wanted -- and in fact were inclined to do the opposite.

I don't think you understand how seriously dysfunctional this administration has been. Perhaps you've heard of the incident, toward the end of this last session, when Oscar Lovelace visited the House. Someone entered a polite resolution to name him "physician for the day" or some such. He stood up in the gallery, and the Republicans went WILD, standing ovation, hooting and hollering, clapping their hands off. I talked to a Democrat or two who said they just looked around in amazement at this much passive hostility aimed toward Sanford.

Everyone was aware that these guys didn't want to see Oscar Lovelace become governor. They just wanted to show what they really though of Sanford.

I can't stress enough how wrong you are if you swallow the standard Sanford campaign line that he is some sort of populist hero fighting the good fight against a bunch of crazed tax-and-spenders. These are conservative people, who would love to do many of the things you would like to see. But they are not about to work with a guy who gets ahead by running them down.

You need to be there. You need to follow this stuff day after day, and talk to some of these frustrated lawmakers.

If this were about him supporting PPIC, and that alone, we'd probably endorse Sanford. Moore doesn't support restructuring, and that's a major strike against him -- although, ironically, he has accomplished a lot more in that direction than Sanford has, since he helped shepherd through the Campbell restructuring in 1993.

We'd probably say we're sticking with Sanford to get some more restructuring, and just plan to keep defeating PPIC by showing what a lousy plan it is. But when you combine his utter failure (what looks almost like a DETERMINATION to fail) on restructuring with the fact that PPIC supporters aren't satisfied to have a straightup debate on the issue (they insist on using all sorts of misleading advertising to stack the legislature in their favor), and you have a pretty poisonous stew.

Posted by: Brad Warthen | Oct 22, 2006 7:37:35 PM

The solution is to replace the obstructionist legislators with people more conservative and libertarian than Mark Sanford.

Electing one of the bad old boy legislators as Governor is precisely how kill any and all reforms.

Posted by: Lee | Oct 22, 2006 7:42:56 PM

Brad,

After Sanford wins re-election, I woudn't sit by the phone waiting for a phone call from him to discuss political theory. But I'm sure Jim Rex will be available...

Posted by: Doug | Oct 22, 2006 7:55:04 PM

There must be something to what Brad is saying. I don’t follow Republican politics, but I couldn’t help but notice a large campaign sign on Forest Drive from these folks.

Posted by: Mark Whittington | Oct 22, 2006 8:31:59 PM

I can't believe you endorsed Tommy Moore. I, too, am grossly disappointed in Mark Sanford. But Tommy Moore? You've got to be kidding. If you don't like the good ole boys, guess what? Tommy Moore IS the good ole boys.

Posted by: Mona Williams | Oct 22, 2006 9:50:43 PM

Brad, you know what that Lovelace anecdote reminds me of? Our 6-year-old, who sometimes gets in trouble and then says to the parent administering the discipline "you're so mean - Daddy/Mommy is much nicer". In other words, Sanford is holding the piggies' feet to the fire and they don't like it one bit; no wonder Lovelace seems so much nicer to them.

IMO you're dead wrong blaming Sanford for the failure of restructuring to-date. I may not go hobnobbing with the piggies in the State House the way a certain editorial page editor does but it's clear to me that the piggies themselves are in total control of any restructuring. Sanford can ask, beg, promise/bribe, plead, cajole, threaten etc. but in the end any action has to come from the piggies. No matter how much they like a governor, somehow I just don't see them cooperating with any dilution of their own power unless they come under extreme political pressure.

could apply at least some of that political pressure on the piggies, instead of criticizing Sanford for trying. Lord knows you've gone on innumerable jihads in the past - why not make this issue the one that gets 2 or 3 editorials a day for 5 or 6 months? You know like video poker or the confederate flag back in the day. Band together with some of the other McClatchy editors in the state and you might even get somewhere. Instead, as Mary Rosh would say, you act like a coward who wants to scapegoat Sanford instead of placing the blame where it really belongs: the piggies in the legislature!



Posted by: LexWolf | Oct 22, 2006 10:02:32 PM

YOU could apply......

Posted by: LexWolf | Oct 22, 2006 10:04:02 PM

Brad,

You say that restructuring is the most important issue to you - then you endorse Moore? I've never posted before but this is just too much to merely read about...that is crazy. Sanford has pushed hard for restructuring...remember the horse and buggy he brought to the legislative chambers? Remember him being the first governor to ever address a Senate subcommittee...and that was to push for restructuring? Why didn't restructuring go anywhere? Because the Senator who you say can "make things happen" failed to get a decent bill out the committee or even to the Senate floor. He and McConnell...Senate cronies for sure...worked together behind the scenes to make sure it never had a prayer of passing.

So restructuring is your most important issue and that's the guy you want in charge? Not a chance it will ever happen if Moore were to win. Fortunately for you and for all of us he won't, which means restructuring has a decent shot with another four years of Mark Sanford. Remember Campbell didn't get restructuring until his 7th year in office and that was only after Sen Moore's buddies in the Senate went to jail over the Lost Trust scandal...otherwise the legislature never would have ceded the power that they did.

You are right...Sanford has kept ticking of lawmakers. But the main reason is that he kept doing exactly what you wanted him to do...push for restructuring and take away their ability to do favors for their lobbyist friends. He starts messing with their money and power-base and of course they are going to look for every opportunity to take him down...and whining to you or cheering for Oscar are perfect examples of that. Hell hath no fury like a good ole boy legislator who's ability to help his special interest is threatened, or something like that. Most of their whining about personality and procedure is a smokescreen because they decided if you can't argue with the message then shoot the messenger. Brad, I hope that you are proud of the job that you continue to do in aiding and abetting them. I'm not because I thought much more highly of you.

I agree that restructuring is the most important issue in our state and nothing substantive can be changed until we have a system that allows us to hold someone accountable as opposed to the faceless mass of good ole boys. I really question that you agree with that statement based upon your endorsement today. Unfortunately, I have to agree with the earlier post that said you and the State editorial board have turned into one-issue anti-school choice zealots. I too am gravely disappointed and disheartened to discover this. You seem to be missing out on the big picture due to the same blinders that hamper all other one-issue fanatics be they in this country or middle-eastern ones.

And Mark, I looked at the names on the Republicans for Moore list. Weston Adams endorsed Hodges four years ago so I'd hardly call him a real Republican. And many of the others are just on the list because they have a personal ax to grind with Sanford. Former Senator John Kuhn, for example, was a key vote to kill restructuing in Moore's Senate subcommittee and as a result lost his seat to upset voters who elected Sanford ally Chip Campsen. The fact that he and Brand find themselves on the same side of the Governor's race just further proves the points that I made above.

Posted by: Rob | Oct 22, 2006 11:24:10 PM

Brad, My legislator is not part of the old boys club and he is highly respected and works across the aisle on some issues, in particular rural development. He voted against the billboard lobby. I am going to get his direct opinion on what you see as dysfunction. We shall see.

Posted by: Dave | Oct 23, 2006 5:12:33 AM

Speaking of endorsements…you called lobbyist Robert Barber a” Methodist minister-turned lawyer” , and used the sentence “Where Mr. Barber shines is in terms of responsibility, maturity, judgment and respect for the public”…..

Mr. Barber appears not to have read your endorsement, and has produced and aired a dark and negative attack against Andre Bauer.

So maybe a better description of Mr. Barber would have been “paid lobbyist, long time politician and desperate to do anything to get into public office”.

Just remember, Andre has barely mentioned his opponent. In the State on Saturday, your articled even referred to Andre complimenting Mr. Barber. But as usual, the State gets the wrong end of the stick…and Barber uses it on them by showing disrespect for Bauer, and the public.


Posted by: Bryan | Oct 23, 2006 5:56:26 AM

Brad,

Just to give you the heads up, Bryan/Chris/ChrisW/Wally/Ronald and perhaps other user handles are all the same person. He's a blog troll who posts under a variety of names to slam Robert Barber. Under various names he's assumed all sorts of identities: public school teacher, African American who is "leaning" Republican, etc. Once I figured this out by connecting the dots of his IP address, I deleted all of his comments and banned him from my site.

Posted by: Laurin | Oct 23, 2006 11:24:51 AM

Laurin, could you check out Lee and Lexwolf, too?

Posted by: Herb Brasher | Oct 23, 2006 11:40:52 AM

Nice try, Herb, but no cigar. I'm me and only me. Now maybe somebody should check out your alternate monikers, and even more so, those of Randy Ewart.



Posted by: LexWolf | Oct 23, 2006 1:14:22 PM

Laurin, explain again how you're certain of that...

Posted by: Brad Warthen | Oct 23, 2006 1:25:53 PM

She's not. It could be a library or office computer for all she knows. Hey Brad, want to kick me off for using an alias?

Posted by: HP | Oct 23, 2006 2:52:54 PM

What's Herb afraid of? It is the "liberals" who engage in most of the slander, phony names, e-mail attacks, etc.

The ones with more guts show up, always in mass, to shout down lectures and discussions with viewpoints other than socialism.

Posted by: Lee | Oct 23, 2006 3:18:19 PM

I dont get it. I use a fake name. Most everyone does. I live with roomates and we all share computers, email accounts, bolg accounts,etc. We have one lap top we take to the internet cafe.
so whats the big deal. abusive language and conduct is the standard.this is not my name. I jsut made it up. I will use another one next time. Are my points less valid?

Posted by: Randy | Oct 23, 2006 3:35:06 PM

Brad,

I got suspicious when I noticed that all these different commenters had very similar email addresses RobertSC@yahoo.com, BryanSC@msn.com, and on and on. It took me weeks to catch on, but I can search all of my comments by IP address (which is the numeric tag for one's internet access point), and all of these commenters were posting from the exact same IP address. I went back and read all of the comments, from all of these different "users" and they were nearly identical in substance -- about 99% were trashing Robert Barber. Where they differed was that one commenter would be an African-American person who learned about Andre Bauer at his church and planned to vote for him, another would be an educator who'd never voted Republican before but was planning to do so this time, yadda yadda.

Blogs are only good when they operate in good faith. The point is not the usage of aliases, which is fine. The problem lies in the abuse of aliases and "trolling" in general. Trolling diminishes the quality of the discussions taking place on the blogs, and quality discussion has always been what I've enjoyed most about running a blog.

Posted by: Laurin | Oct 23, 2006 3:52:32 PM

Does anyone know if Mark Twain's mom called him Mark, or Samuel?

from a share computer...wondering who else has posted from here...

Posted by: Laurin | Oct 23, 2006 4:13:46 PM

Brad,

The commenter above is a troller who poached my name. (Roll over it and note the bogus email address.) Would you mind deleting it?

Posted by: (the real) Laurin | Oct 23, 2006 4:24:28 PM

Hey Lee and Lex,

Laugh once in awhile. I know Lex does, I've never seen Lee crack a joke yet.

Hey, I've even agreed with you once in awhile; OK, not very often, but sometimes we do.

Anyway, I tried to be funny.

To the other, will the real Laurin please stand up? I'm getting confused; which doesn't take much to accomplish, I'll freely admit.

Posted by: Herb Brasher | Oct 23, 2006 5:08:13 PM

You have no points.

Posted by: Spencer Gantt | Oct 23, 2006 6:06:44 PM

This is like a Tom Cruise Mission Impossible movie with everyone pulling off masks.

Herb, to his credit, Lee make a funny at my expense - one-upped me.

Posted by: Randy Ewart | Oct 23, 2006 11:56:27 PM

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